EP 180: Future Histories Of Black Magic - Black Witch Council 2023 Part 2 with Zoe Flowers, Loli Moon, Thea Anderson, Sherry Shone and OlaOmi Amoloku

In a circle of precipice energy with Zoe Flowers, Loli Moon, Thea Anderson, Sherry Shone and OlaOmi Amoloku.

Amy Torok
Feb 16, 2023
56 min read
Black WitchcraftFeminist MagicActivist MagicAstrologyImbolcSabbat SpecialsWitches FoundTranscripts
Clockwise from top left: Thea, Zoe, Loli, Sherry and OlaOmi

For the second part of our 2 part series, "Future Histories of Black Magic" we're joined by writer, occultist, healer Zoe Flowers, astrologer, natural mystic, revolutionary Loli Moon, author Sherry Shone (aka That Hoodoo Lady), astrologer, writer, astro-historian Thea Anderson and author, educator OlaOmi Amoloku (aka Got2BOshun).

Together we sharpen our machetes and tongues to discuss capitalism, deliverance, magnificence, magic, self-worth, interaction, connection, the right to pleasure, orgasms, and papayas, and keeping the unity in community.

We are at precipice energy.  Listen now!

Spirit is so surprising!


Zoe Flowers

Zoe Flowers

Check out Tarot 101 (and coming soon - magical candles) on Zoe Flowers's website and find her on instagram. Buy her books From Ashes To Angel’s Dust and In Praise of the Wytch.

My anger is magic. Magic is awareness of self.


Loli Moon

Loli Moon

Find Loli Moon on Patreon, on Instagram, on YouTube and on her website.  Check out the What's The Brew podcast!

All this magic is real. Love is real.


Sherry Shone

Sherry Shone

Find Sherry on her website and on Instagram.  Buy her books Hoodoo For Everyone and The Hoodoo Guide To The Bible. Sherry recommends Third Eye bookstore in Oregon.  Keep an eye out for future Hoodoo Wine & Sip events - the first will be in May 2023.

Why did I have to go through the things that I went through? It was to get my magic.


Thea Anderson

Thea Anderson 

Find Thea on her website and on Instagram, and keep an eye out for her short story appearing in the upcoming anthology Infinite Constellations (pre-order now). Thea is also the Director of Production at CHANI and assistant editor at Triangle House.

You have to know that you are worthy to wield your power in this universe. 


OlaOmi Amoloku

OlaOmi aka Got2BOshun

Find OlaOmi (Got2BOshun) on her website, on Instagram and on YouTube.  Buy her books Ona Agbani, S'Otito~Be Truth, and Raising Revolutionaries.  Check out Witchy Wednesdays and other classes!!  Or just send some money magic to her Tip Jar.


Full Transcript

MW BWC part 2

Amy: [00:00:00] The Missing Witches Podcast is entirely listener funded. If you wanna support the Missing Witches Project, become a subscriber. Check out the all new missingwitches.com.  

Intro: You aren't being a proper woman. Therefore, you must be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. You must be a witch.  

Amy: Hello, and welcome to another episode of The Missing Witches Podcast. I'm Amy, and I'm so super thrilled to be here recording part two of our Special: Future Histories of Black Magic. It's Black History Month, but the people that I'm in circle with today are creating our black history of the future, and we're so grateful to have them.

Amy: Very quickly, we are joined by Zoe and Sherry and OlaOmi and Thea and Loli and I want to start by asking Zoe if you will do a little reading, and also if you can [00:01:00] introduce yourselves to our listeners who maybe haven't met you before. All of you wonderful witches have been on the podcast before. I hope that our listeners will go and revisit your episodes if you miss them.

Amy: Zoe Flowers, writer, occultist, healer, hit us with your energy.  

Zoe: Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Amy. Thank you. Listeners. I'm Zoe Flowers. I'm calling in today from the original land of the Podunk, the Pequannock people, and many more here in Hartford, Connecticut. My pronouns are she and they, I am a black woman with black, curly hair, red glasses, red lipstick, a black sweater, and a little necklace, black necklace.

Zoe: Okay, and the poem I'm gonna read is In the Blood:  

Zoe: Soon, and very soon I will disremember, how you gutted, sucker punched, split me in two, cracked me wide, fed on all that lived, leaving only carcass in its place. [00:02:00] Shell-shocked, bones picked dry, I rise. But like walkers, of not fully awake. Ritual slow, I begin exercising you from cell memory, hypnotize myself to un-love you, cleanse root, sacral crown. You've helped me become strategic, employing ancient recipes, visiting the mat. I sit at the Baba's feet. Orisha say, you not the one move on. It ain't that deep. I'm a shown machete cords that keep us linked. Carry black onyx between legs, burying it in the ground when my cycle is complete. When loneliness threatens to overtake me, I pull out the receipts all the while reminding myself to breathe.

Zoe: Ancient message. My DNA birthed civilization. I am the one I seek. I great-grandmother, my inner child become Obeah lady. Put your name in the freezer. Stay on Duppy alert. Sprinkle black salt. Cross my doorway. Burn yellow, blue, and white, candles. Bathe in oranges and rue. Bless my head [00:03:00] with myhrr. At sunset, I am forgetting about you. Offering Cowry shells, offering Cowryies and honey to the river. Pineapple to the ocean. Myself, to any enlightened ancestor that will listen. I ask Ohsun if this is payback. For those I kilt, she tells me, look for sweetness. Bless all that cursed me. She is not the source of guilt. Fully awake or reclear. The roots begin to loosen and you are becoming no thing, more than practice in urban legend.

Zoe: The more I pray, the more your relevance is lessened. You have become eight track, because it is I that is honey to the bee. And soon you will be haint restless searching for spells to unloose you from me.

Zoe: In the Blood.  

Zoe: Thank you.  

Amy: So, can you tell us who you are and a little bit about the book that, that came from, because the story behind that book is incredible.  

Zoe: Thank you. Thank you so much. So [00:04:00] this is my first book, From Ashes to Angels Dust: A Journey through Womanhood. And you know, I'm an occultist, I'm a healer, person. Gosh, yeah, a curious person in the world. And, you know, a magical being. Happy to be here.  

Amy: A magical being. Indeed. Thank you so much. You know, I will say one more time, I took a little trip to Brooklyn last summer and absolutely one of the highlights was getting to meet Zoe Flowers in person, having a meal with you and breaking bread. It really, I'll cherish it until the next time we meet in person again.  

Zoe: So, perfect. It was so perfect and magical. Even the way that it happened, it was like, yeah.  

Amy: Yeah, it was very witchy and meant to be.  

Zoe: Was extremely witchy, Yeah.  

Amy: I want to, move on to Loli Moon. I [00:05:00] will introduce you as Mystic Moon Medicine, an astrologer, but also as a revolutionary.

Amy: And I wanna do that because, Risa and I attribute and quote you all the time you said to us. Something to the effect of that "we could use astrology to find our place in the revolution". Mm-hmm. And that struck such a major chord with us, and I, and I apply it elsewhere too, outside of astrology, like how can this help me learn my place in the revolution? So can you introduce yourselves to those who were unlucky enough to miss you last time you were on the podcast? Thank you so much for being here.  

Loli: Thank you so much for having me again. I'm so, so, so honored and very grateful. I'm grateful to hold space with all of you as well.

Loli: Happy Black History Month. Happy Black Future Month. Happy Black Freedom Month. Okay, my name is Lily Moon. I also go by the na[00:06:00] was given to me by the Erisha. I have given myself many labels before in the past, and because my focus for this month is freedom, I'm going to allow myself to be free of labels.

Loli: I am well known for being an astrologer. Yes, but to keep it simple, I'm a natural mystic. I am a Canadian, Jamaican woman. I reside on Algonquin territory and, I'm here to take up space unapologetically and, authentically as myself. And yes, part of my reasoning for being here is to remind people that you have the power.

Loli: Yes, you know, our spirit guides, our ancestors, et cetera, are here to help us with our path. But at the end of the day, we have the power to decide how to react to things. And when it comes to revolution, it is very easy to get very emotional and get very caught up in the tidal waves of what comes with the revolution.

Loli: But we must remember to stay focused and stay grounded in our bodies. We are spiritual beings having human [00:07:00] experiences, and we have a mission to complete. There is no other choice. Okay? We are the granddaughters, we are the women. We are the witches who were burnt at the stake and we remember everything.

Loli: Okay? And so while that is happening, I remember my place. I remember all the hats I wore back then, and I'm here to add on to those and to keep it pushing. So, I understand what your place is in the revolution. And understand that your place in revolution can also change. Maiden, Mother, Crone. Your place of of the Maiden is going to change, your place as the Mother, and as the Crone and throughout the revolution as well in that same way.

Loli: And so embracing those changes is very, very, very important. Everyone's that's listening to this right now, we went through some really intense changes last year, right? The eclipses on the Taurus / Scorpio axis, that is continuing this year. Those changes and those roles are going to change as well. And we must continue to roll with the tides.

Loli: Honey, keep it. Keep surfing. Keep swimming. We're gonna make it. We'll be okay. We [00:08:00] got each other. That's all that matters. Our magic is our sword, okay? Our words are our wands. Our spirits are our shield, and we stand. We come as one, but we stand as 10,000, a million, and so on and so on and so on. So, you know, as overwhelming as it can be to be here right now, what is coming is why we are here.

Loli: Okay? What has happened so far is just the trailer of the movie. What is coming is why we are here. So don't ever question why you are here. Don't ever question. Why is this happening to you? It's happening for you, beloved. It's happening for all of us. Okay? This is the year of the seven they say, the year of the sharet.

Loli: It's more than that, seven sisters, seven continents, seven oceans, okay? Seven days of the week. Seven celestial bodies. When you heal thy self, you heal seven generations before you, seven generations after you. So when I say black history month and black future month, black freedom month, that's what I'm talking about.

Loli: So, it's everything in between. So [00:09:00] take it all in. Inhale, exhale, release it all. But yeah, that's me. I'm Loli Moon, The Natural Mystic. Free of labels right now.

Amy: Listeners, now you know what the fuck we're talking about, like when you feel the energy coming off. Thank you again so much for being here and bringing that spirit to this conversation. Thank you so much. I'm stoked. Great stoker of fire, you're like a little iron poker and I'm all, now I'm all shaking in my chair.

Loli: Yes, that's what I'm here to do. I'm here to sharpen the machetes, honey. Okay?  

Amy: Yes, yes. Thank you. thank you, thank you, thank you. We need poets and we need warriors, and if we can be both at once, that's ideal. Another warrior poet, Sherry Shone, that Hoodoo Lady, author. How are you doing? What are you doing? Hi.

Sherry: Oh, [00:10:00] so much, so much. First of all, thank you everyone for listening in. Thank you for all of my sisters in Witchydom, and conjure and root work and everything else that we call ourselves. I come to you, I met Amy and Risa, and they embraced me and welcomed me. It's the reason I have my second book. I did the first book, the Hoodoo Guide to the Bible, all self-published, and Amy said, oh, no, you don't.

Sherry: You're gonna go through a publisher. And I said, no, I don't know about all that. But anyway, so there it went, and now it is, and now it's continuing, and I'm continuing to do more and more, but only through what spirit and my, ancestors ask me to. Some of the things that I am working on is acceptance in your Conjure and in your Hoodoo.

Sherry: I am an agreement with what Ms. Lilly Moon said. When it [00:11:00] is about these labels, these labels are continuing to tear us apart and divide us. We started as a nation of one, as a continent of one. And, what's happening is you keep hearing these divisors, right? Let's divide, let's divide, let's divide.

Sherry: The reason they want you to divide is because they want you to be susceptible on your own, right? Every time I go walking around, I have two greyhounds. They are beautiful. They are named Zephyric and Zenahari. They are both named after either the Zephyric is the God of wind, and Zenahari is Madagaskan King. But anyway, my two boys, they go everywhere with me and the reason they go everywhere with me is because I don't like to be alone in spirit, and I don't like to be alone and vulnerable walking streets.

Sherry: I am here in Oregon [00:12:00] where there's not a lot of darker melanated bodies. So whenever I go walking, I have to be ready for people to come up to me and say, is this your neighborhood? Is this your car? Is this your wife? Are these your dogs? So me walking around with my greyhounds gives me that courage, but I am excited to be able to be on this call and talk about and share with each other.

Sherry: The more we work together and accept each other in our own spiritual practices, the more we dispel the disbelief, the myth that all we do is argue and divide as a nation and as a race. We are not here to divide. Right? We do so much more and together. Together. When we think of the ring shout? Back in the day when we formed a circle, and we dusted up the dust in the [00:13:00] sand and we brought up spirit in the name of, and we continued to work together and sing and song and chant and pray together, and people got their deliverance together.

Sherry: It was because we did that stuff together, not because I was doing work towards somebody else to make somebody else go lower. So anyway, that is why I am here and that is why I am grateful to be blessed by everyone on this call. And I hope that everyone else feels this energy, y'all. I'm in the black magical shirt.

Sherry: Everybody else on the call is looking beautiful in their black and white and blue, and we are not playing today y'all. So I hope y'all are ready. I hope you have your tea. You have your refreshments. You gonna need 'em!  

Amy: We are not playing around tonight. I do wanna say one thing. You know, I appreciate the credit, but zero credit, we've talked about this before.

Amy: Jeremiah 29:11, somebody had big plans for you and I just happened to be the [00:14:00] person that sent the email that connected the two, you know, instruments of God to each other. Jeremiah 29:11, that's our motto, me and Sherry Shone. Do you wanna do a quick reading from Hoodoo for Everyone?  

Sherry: Absolutely.

Sherry: So, one of the things that I talk about in the book, and I'm just gonna read really quickly. "As a Hoodoo practitioner, my job is to make sure that I pass along the knowledge of oral tradition of Hoodoo. To do this, I tell the history of its people. The black people of North America who were transported into enslavement by way of the diaspora.

Sherry: Our history is interwoven with other melanated cultures. America is founded on the ideals of freedom and built by the hard work of immigrants and those impacted by the diaspora. The diaspora is the involuntary dispersion of a group of individuals from one [00:15:00] geographic location to another, such as from the birthplace of all humankind Africa, to Europe, to North or South America.

Sherry: Our ancestors from many cultures have been impacted by the diaspora. This is universal. Therefore, our shared pain is universal. Our shared experiences of being displaced and abandoned is universal. Our shared experience of being displaced, our need for connection and community in a world that is not ours is universal.

Sherry: This may be why many of us feel we don't belong here, because our roots were shifted from us without permission. Hoodoo is so precious to me because Hoodoo was made by a people that needed deliverance, and deliverance is a universal need".[00:16:00]  

Amy: Deliverance. Thank you.  

Sherry: It's a universe.  

Amy: Thank you. Yeah, I'm gonna light my candle for deliverance tonight for sure.  

Amy: Thea, astrologer writer, astro historian, what are you doing? How are you weaving the stars into your research, into the human experience? Tell us what you've been up to. Tell us everything.  

Thea: Hi y'all.

Thea: My name is Thea. I feel so, I am blessed. I am blessed, and I am blessed to be here. And this moment is a blessing because I think about that we are gathered together and then there's an audience that will listen and then our ancestors are here and that, this is just so much bigger and I'm just, I'm so grateful for this moment.

Thea: I think, [00:17:00] you know, I checked the chart when we started recording and in my place in the Berkshires in Massachusetts, where I am currently located, it had Virgo Rising, making Mercury the chart ruler in the fifth house of what we create. So we can think of what we're gonna, what we're gonna pass along through our words.

Thea: And then the moon is in Cancer and the 11th House of Community.  

Thea: And what are we here to talk about? Community, and how are we gonna do this, y'all? How are we gonna do this? We're gonna do it in a way that is about care about all the Moon and Cancer things. Right? It is, a different kind of community than we've seen that's what we need.

Thea: We need something that is life giving. And I think about sometimes what I do, I feel like I'm a midwife to words. You know? I take other people's words. I take my [00:18:00] words and I, think about the way that those words give birth to a life that is just, way more beyond. You know what I can conceive, it's often a download if we're talking about my creative work, my research and sometimes I'll feel that pressure to like, I need to get this out into the world.

Thea: And then I realize, no, I'm being guided, right? These moments of spiraling in and out of research, these moments of becoming enchanted and disenchanted with the world, with the work that is all part of the process. And so I'm here sitting here as a human being in process always. And I think that when we can allow each other to see each other and accept each other in our own process, we come into loving community, which with each other.

Thea: I'm not interested in power. I'm not interested in things that divide. I'm interested in where [00:19:00] are we going to be? Where could we be if we just all saw that, that was all like smoke and mirrors. Us as a people to come together and to honor, you know, I sat with Black History Month because we're living in this really weird time where sometimes I'm not sure if things have been commodified or marketed.

Thea: And then sometimes I'm not sure if this is no, Thea you need to sit back and reclaim this. So that is Black History Month. That is, and especially as a Texan, I'm from Houston. To see Juneteenth sort of take a national stage over the last couple years and like, what does that mean? How am I, do I still? Is that still my like little private thing?

Thea: And now it's everybody. It's, not. And so like, what does this mean? And I think to me it always means, it's always a reclaiming. It's always bringing it back into living context. It's always being like, this is something that, we're not gonna let people take it [00:20:00] from us, appropriate it, and then claim it as theirs.

Thea: This is something that we enter into, that we own and that we share. And so I love, what was just read, Sherry, what you read about like it not being freedom, but is deliverance. There's a call, there's an invitation and there's a, there's also an invitation on us to take other people with us. That deliverance is not an endpoint, but it's also a process.

Thea: So I'm just so honored to be here. I could keep going on, but I'm gonna stop.  

Amy: We're gonna come back around to you. Don't you worry about that. Save something. Keep something in the chamber for later. Thank you so much for that rising. You know, one of my favorite pieces that you wrote is, of course, about someone who is a North star to probably all of us, Harriet Tubman and tracing, the sort of astrological journey, for lack of a better term, and sort of looking at her chart and the charts of the events, of her life.[00:21:00]  

Amy: So I hope she's one of the ancestors who's with us tonight. And thank you so much for being a future ancestor and being with me here today.  

Amy: OlaOmi I just, you know, the first time I saw OlaOmi was on Facebook, and we've talked about this before, but I won't get into it so I won't get into it too much, but I was like this person, and I was like, every social media account I could find attached to this, but I want to know every single word this person says for the rest of time.

Amy: And then I finally got up the guts to ask you to come on the podcast and you were on our Panel for Choice. Which was obviously a super emotional topic, but a also a very, very important one. And I love inviting you because I know you're gonna tell it like it is. You're not gonna pull any punches and I'm gonna learn something for sure.

Amy: How are you, what are you doing? [00:22:00] What's going on?  

OlaOmi: I am magnificent, all praises and honors to my ancestral mothers. There is no better place to be, but in the company of my sisters. So thank you all so much for being here and creating a safe space. That is always the best place to be. It is what I incarnated to do. Right?

OlaOmi: Um, what am I doing? I am still working on the PhD will probably be finished in 2024. And really leaning into, as far as that research is concerned. Hoodoo, conjure, rootworking as a spiritual liberation technology? Right. It is a technological tool that our ancestors used to survive. So that is what I'm always, always doing, have been doing for the past four years.

OlaOmi: And it's a blessing. It is [00:23:00] wonderful. I love it. Even being here in the great state of Florida, and I say that very sarcastically, but I think that, well, I know that what we do as witches, and I teach this in some of my classes, is we deal with what is real. We don't deal with what is constructed. So there are some terrible constructs, right, that just are not real.

OlaOmi: We have a gender binary construct. It's just not real. So witches don't deal with that. We deal with reality. Right? We have a race construct. It is not real, witches don't deal with that. We deal with reality. Right? We have a white supremacist or, white masculist imperialism construct. We don't deal with that.

OlaOmi: We deal with reality, right? It doesn't mean that we don't live in these [00:24:00] places. It doesn't mean that those things do not affect us, and it certainly doesn't mean that we ignore it or that we pretend it doesn't exist, but our work, and therefore our lives, take place in reality. Right? So what is real is that Earth Mother Onile, has completed her dance through the darkness, and even though it's winter and it's winter here in Florida, not temperature-wise, but you can still feel the sleepy vibe of Earth Mother, right?

OlaOmi: She's still in her sleepy vibe, right? So even though she's still doing that, we know that now is the time when she's beginning to move back towards the sun. And so we feel a bubbling. Right? So this is the reality we're living in cuz that's what's really happening. Right? And the rest of this is a construct that's created to keep us in a certain state of terror.

OlaOmi: Because people, and especially those of us who are feminine [00:25:00] people, women and fems, we react in desperation when we're in a state of terror. So, you know, I'm here in Florida and people always say, Ugh. And I'm an educator in Florida. So there are people say, oh no, I've heard that they're taking books off of shelves.

OlaOmi: And that's true, that's true. They're doing all of that. And I, and they say, and how are you? And I'm like, actually I'm magnificent. Right? It's a beautiful sunny day. When I go out in my backyard, there are cranes and herons. That will walk up to my gate and say, good morning to me, there's 20,000 different types of lizards that I have to keep my cats in the house, or they will decimate the lizard population of Florida. Right?

OlaOmi: There is beauty all around and it's warm. So I can go outside every day and be mostly new. So I'm magnificent. I live in reality. So I think that for me, that's the focus, right? Making sure that I stay in reality, obviously staying safe, [00:26:00] obviously not being oblivious, but living in reality. Who am I? I am a hereditary witch.

OlaOmi: My mother told me that I came from a long line of witches when I was about four years old. She and I were communicating without speaking, and so she told me to come into the room, and I came into the room and she said, I didn't call your name. And I said, I know, but you told me to come in here. So I came in here.

OlaOmi: And so she, cause you know, Lalita, boy said to do something, you was gonna do it even now from the spirit realm she said to do something, my ass is gonna do it. Right? I got good sense and I'm hardheaded, but I ain't foolish. So I'm a hereditary witch. I'm coming from a line, a family line that is of First Nations people here in the United States and West African people coming from [00:27:00] Nigeria.

OlaOmi: I'm initiated priests of Oshun for over 30 years. So our praises to that and coming from the deep rural south, a practitioner of Hoodoo since before I was born. Right? That is what it means to live as a person of color. Where I'm from, is that you are practicing Hoodoo and, not knowing. You know, you don't know that it has a name.

OlaOmi: There's a whole point in your life when you're doing and you don't even know that there's a name to it. This is just what you do. This is how you stay well, this is how you stay fed. This is how you bring money into the house. This is how you stay alive. So that is who I am. Mother of six, teacher of literature, Afrofuturism in particular.

OlaOmi: And yeah, happy Black Future and Black History Month to everyone. And also happy day of being together, right? [00:28:00] Happy day of coming together. I think that the path of living in reality can be very lonely. So I cherish moments when I can come together with people who are not pretending to be something else for the sake of their survival.

OlaOmi: So I cherish it. Happy moment of being together, right? It's a blessing.  

Amy: Thank you for claiming your magnificence. It is self-evident to us in the room here. But for those listening, the magnificence is very real. And I, and I love that you use that word there. It there, it's something greater than good. It's magnificent.

Amy: And you have one of my favorite definitions of magic, which I will misquote now. But you, you wrote something along the lines of like, "magic is when the universe conspires to let you know that you are lifted". [00:29:00] Can you expand on that a little bit? And then maybe we'll all talk about what magic means.  

OlaOmi: Yes.

OlaOmi: Magic is when you work in conjunction with the universe. And the universe lets you know that she sees you and that she hears you and that she's working with you. And it usually happens in little things. And so in the post that you're speaking of, the children and I had carved our jack-o'-lanterns as we do on Samhain to light the path for our unrighteous ancestors, cuz that's the one day that we talk to them and feed them.

OlaOmi: And in, where I'm from, after you carve your jack-o'-lantern, you put the pumpkin seeds out in your yard cuz the pumpkin seeds bring wealth. And so I had never carved a jack-o'-lantern in Florida, nor had I sprinkled pumpkin seeds in Florida. So I'm from a whole different ecosystem of Tennessee, right? So first of all, for y'all who didn't know, jack-o'-lanterns ain't going to [00:30:00] last to Halloween in Florida, you gotta carve'em late. You can't carve'em early like I'm used to doing cause this sun will just eat the jack-o'-lantern. And I was like, what is happening to my jack-o'-lantern? How the ancestors gonna get here if they caving in? So anyway, that's the first thing. Second thing, you know, I was sprinkling my pumpkin seed and I'm saying, you know, Earth Mother Onile, bring us wealth, continue to protect us, blah blah blah, blah.

OlaOmi: And in the video that Amy is referencing, all these birds begin to come in cuz I live, there's a pond, you know, across in my backyard, they call it something else down here, a canal I think is what they call it. But it's in my backyard. And so all these birds began to fly in and the big old huge cranes and herons.

OlaOmi: And I was like, oh. Because from a worker perspective, the birds are the Mothers and the Mothers are who you always wanna be talking to cuz they hold all the power in the universe. So I realized this moment is magic. Right? And we [00:31:00] love our wands and we love our ability to, you know, communicate in our minds, and we love our ability to move things and make things happen.

OlaOmi: We love all of that. But magic is those little tiny moments when you throwing your pumpkin seeds out and a whole flock of birds, some of them as tall as me. Not that I'm very tall, but y'all know what I mean. Come into your yard to eat and to watch you do it, and to say, we are witnessing this moment. And yes, we hear you.

OlaOmi: That's magic. Right? Yeah.  

Amy: Zoe, your project is called The Magic Hours. You must have thoughts on this word magic. This idea of magic.  

Zoe: I might have a few thoughts on magic . I love magic.  

Zoe: I, gosh, I love magic, and I'm so happy that I actively started interacting with it. [00:32:00] I think intentionally because while other things have happened in my life that I felt less than magical, I will say I've had little sparks of magic and experiences my whole life, thankfully.

Zoe: But the last, I don't know. I don't even know. I don't know, 15 years or so, I started actually interacting with it. And so for me, magic could be like when I'm looking for a parking space and I hear something in my ear. Right? And they're like, turn left, turn right. I remember they used to just say, stop, wait.

Zoe: And I would just be, I'd be like, okay, but not really believing yet. Right? Like not trusting my parking magic. And then it just was like, yeah, I have like parking angels. It's great. Right? And so for me it's, it's this interaction. And for me it's [00:33:00] an every day at this point interaction, constantly looking for it.

Zoe: It is my interaction with deities. It is my interaction with the cards, the fact that, you know, I could be giving a reading to somebody I don't even know. And then all of a sudden I start feeling something on my neck and I'm, and I start itching and I'm like, oh, do you feel such and such when this and that happens?

Zoe: And they're like, yes! And I'm like, oh my God! Cause it's like, still is so, like, spirit is just, it's still so surprising. And I think that that's it. It's surprising. I started working with Hecate recently. And I don't know, I think I was in the car talking to Hecate or something and then I pulled into my mother's driveway and there was a Raven just sitting there and I got my camera out.

Zoe: This is like last week. And I started video and I was like, yes!  

Zoe: It's the girl I know you, you wit me, you wit me. You know, it's like stuff like that. It is this [00:34:00] relationship between me and as we're talking about the Mothers, like I started reading the Great Cosmic Mother. If you haven't read the Great Cosmic Mother, read the Great Cosmic Mother, cuz that's like a whole nother level.

Zoe: So it's like, me talking to the Goddesses and feeling connected to the Goddesses and like you said, small, I'm thinking about somebody they call me on the phone. That's magic. Right? And then there's the other like stuff that I like, making candles, like making magical candles and like that type of stuff that I really love.

Zoe: Like the spell work. There's the spell work of it too, which I really love. But yeah, I love it. I do. It's like everything to me.  

Zoe: Yeah, yeah,  

Sherry: It's just so good. Oh, Thea, please go ahead.  

Thea: No, I just wanted to say like, sometimes we've had to go through [00:35:00] things to get the magic and that's what came up for me when you were talking, like, sometimes when life doesn't feel magical, you could feel like disconnect or like almost like a parent that has left you, and do I still matter?

Thea: And sometimes those moments could take like, years. And I've been thinking about this a lot recently for myself, like, why did I have to go through the things that I went through and it was to get my magic!  

Sherry: Ooh, you said it. The things we go through. And I was always a crier. I loved to, I was one of those that when I was in the church, everybody else would be running up and down the aisles and getting [00:36:00] happy and doing everything cuz that was my tradition.

Sherry: And I would be in the pew going like this, just shaking my head just back and forth, just, ooh, just doing it. Right? I was in it. I was in it. And for me, when I think about my magic, the tears come, and I don't know whether they're tears of my grandmother. Going, look at my granddaughter, who now can confidently do anything she does in magic without fear of being lynched, without fear of someone taking it away, without fear of someone coming and claiming it because she knows her worth.

Sherry: And if there's anything that I wanna tell everyone that's listening is, y'all, we are worth it. You are [00:37:00] worth so much in gold in spiritual currency. Y'all, if we could just feel it just today, just breathe it in and just know that all of this love y'all are feeling, breathe it in. Please let it happen. Let it just bathe you in it.

Sherry: That all this magic is real. This is not made up. This is not a joke. This love is real. And that part is magic to me. And that's, I think what makes me cry is because the beauty of it. Y'all... alright? Woo.  

Amy: Loli, I feel like you could give us all some advice about knowing your worth.  

Loli: Well, I can do my absolute best.

Loli: I was writing down what magic means to me, and I wrote, the first thing that came up to me was: Magic is awareness of self and your place in the realms. And [00:38:00] by realms I mean all of them. Because when you reach that level of awareness of self, you realize that all the synchronicities, all the confirmation that you are chasing are all answers of yourself. They're all reflections of yourself. And, you know, when you reach that level of, and there's not really a level to reach honestly and truly, it's just the, the learning really the relearning of self and the unlearning of what the world told you to be, the unlearning of the roles that the world put on you and told you to carry.

Loli: And the world has told me to carry a lot of things. The world has told me to be tough and to be quiet and to be grateful and to not complain, you know? The world has told me that I come from a line of angry people and why are they like that? And that is not true. And you know what? To hell yeah they are angry. And we have every right to be, my anger is magic. My resiliency is magic. My [00:39:00] presence is magic. I don't have to lift a finger if I don't want to. Okay? So your awareness of self. Is magic because when you reach that complete wholeness of self, you reach oneness with spirit, with the divine, with the Goddesses, with the Mothers of the Realms.

Loli: And that is magic and your self worth is reflection of, you know, your magic, essentially. Do you believe in yourself? Do you believe that you are worthy of even practicing magic? Are you, do you believe that you are worthy of receiving synchronicities? Or do you think that, oh, they're just lucky? No luck is preparation meets opportunity.

Loli: How does that happen? Through magic, through awareness of self. This idea of kill the ego, the ego is bad. Stop that. The ego tells you that you have boundaries, you have worth, and you are not delusional. Everyone wants to be, oh, be delusional. [00:40:00] Manifest. No, be real with yourself. Your idea of self-worth is not delusional.

Loli: It's worthy, it's real, it's concrete. It is the earth. It is real. It is rooted in reality. It is rooted in the sacrifices, the blood shedding of your ancestors. So to me, magic is awareness of self on all the rounds. It's awareness of my mother before my mother, you know? And so on and so on and so on. Lives within me right now, and awareness of that.

Loli: That is magic. That synchronicity. When I put down my offerings on my ancestor altar and my Pisces grandmother calls me in five seconds, that's magic. But that comes from the awareness of self and knowing that this is what's going to happen because I said so, not because delusions or illusions or whatever it might be, because I said so.

Amy: I recently did a pre-interview. This person wanted, hi Linda, if you're listening, hiho [00:41:00] Linda. She wanted to do a pre-interview because we had never met before and she had never been on a podcast before. And of course, I want you to be as comfortable as possible. Of course, let's meet ahead of time.

Amy: And she was sort of, you know, that like humble and slightly self-deprecating. And I said, I have to stop you right here. This is not the place for that. I want to hear about how powerful you are. I want to hear about how strong you are and amazing you are. I wanna hear about how crumpled and sad and weak you are.

Amy: That's fine too. You don't need to come here as a perfect being, but like, let's leave. This is not the circle where we are humble. This is the circle where we come to recognize each other's power. Thank you so much, Loli Moon, you, it's just a match. Just a match striking under my little butt.  

OlaOmi: I gotta jump in there with, with Sister Loli Moon, because that's exactly why I started teaching Black Witchcraft, [00:42:00] is because every time I would talk about witchcraft, I mean, I could talk about the Aresha. I could talk about Hoodoo, I couldn't in those days mention a lot of Rootwork and Conjure because people still had a lot of scaredness attached to that.

OlaOmi: But every time I would talk about witchcraft, black women would tell me that's not for them. Right? They don't have the right to do that, what you just spoke about. They don't have the right. To dabble in that. And I was like, who? Where is that coming from? I had to get to the root of that feeling of not being entitled to ALL of the magic.

OlaOmi: So you think it's a little magic pie and it's only one little slice of it that you get to have and all the rest of the magic pie. You can't put your fork over there. Right? So I definitely in the beginning of every class delve into the fact that the whole magic pie is for you. Your ancestral mothers helped to create it and they made it [00:43:00] literally for you, specifically for you.

OlaOmi: They had your specific self in mind as they were creating the magical pie. But yes, that thing you have to know that you are worthy to do magic and that you are worthy to wield your power in this universe and worthy to take from it what you want. And I really, when I did the reading of the year this year, what Oshun said to me was, we're not only worthy, we are entitled. We're entitled to that.

OlaOmi: Before we were born, we laid all of our things out before us and then we said, okay, let me go on and come into the world. And then we get to the world and we say, oh, people who look like me don't get to have that. People who got this many kids don't get to make that kind of salary. People who've been married this much or ain't never been married, or ain't never been chosen by the right person with a penis don't get to have this, that and the other.

OlaOmi: Right? We, we make up all these reasons [00:44:00] that we don't get to have this shit that we laid out for ourselves. And so I don't get to have that it, it's dangling front of me all the time. It's my deepest desire. I really, really want it, but I don't get to have it. All of that is a state of unworthiness, so we gotta come back to our entitlement.

OlaOmi: Right? You're entitled to that. Right? You big enough to fulfill that big ass destiny that you feel on the inside. You're big enough to fulfill that, and you're entitled to every little molecule of whatever it is that gives you the ability to fulfill that destiny and makes you happy while you're doing it.

OlaOmi: Right? Because man out here fulfilling destinies to be miserable either, and my destiny is not a servant or a mule. I'm here to help people. I'm not. I'm here to have magnificent orgasms and dance naked in places that are warm. That's why the fuck I incarnated. And so, yeah, that's what I'm doing, and I can teach people along the way.

OlaOmi: Yeah, I got classes [00:45:00] about magic. Yeah, I write books. Yeah, I teach literature. But when the hell, I said I was coming here. I said, Ooh, look at that orgasm thing. I's gonna go do that over and over again. And ooh, that sun looks delicious, and look at this sand that I can dance in. That's what I'm here to do. So I want us to come outta that mindset of thinking, like you're saying, that this humility has to be attached, that this smallness has to be attached, that this squeezing yourself into some sort of tiny ball whose purpose is to give and give and give of itself to others, and to never feel bliss, and to never feel ecstasy and to not have a good time?

OlaOmi: That's not why we came here. When people, when I ask people that, when I do divinations for people and they say, oh, I came here to help somebody. I say, nobody came here to help people, why did you come here? Helping people is something that you do on the side of what your actual destiny is. What did you come here to do?

OlaOmi: Some [00:46:00] of us came here just to taste a papaya. We're having a human experience. What did you wanna do? I wanted to taste that particular fruit and have the juice run down my, and fell it, run down my skin. Right? There's a reason that you came here. Helping people with something that you also do, and that's not your reason for being right?

OlaOmi: You're not a mule, you're not a mammy or a maid. So yes, agreed. We're entitled to magic and bliss.  

Zoe: And I feel like it's, it can be like a lofa because the world has piled so many things. And so one of the things that I've started doing is when I'm in the shower and I'm like, scrubbing, right? But I'm shedding, I'm shedding, I'm shedding because I want to, listen.

Zoe: Capricorn rising astrology people, so you already know, okay Capricorn rising! So there's a [00:47:00] lot of me working, there's a lot of like, I've gotta do this, I've gotta do that. But I'm like, oh, people are getting soft. Like, what's this soft thing? What's this enjoyment thing, right? Cause I'm also Libras Sun, so I'm like, I'm doing my Venus a disservice.

Zoe: Like what? What? I'm working too hard. So, I've started to like, I got this beautiful rose cleanser, shower gel. And when I'm in there, I'm like scraping off and I'm seeing like that old messaging and that like worker bee energy, like sloughing off. And I think that magic can be, that it can be a response to capitalism.

Zoe: And this is how I've started talking with organizations that I work with around having them do group rituals as a response to capitalism and you know, their nonprofits. So it's like, I can go there with that conversation with them and, and we know it's real, you know, [00:48:00] y'all are talking about reality.

Zoe: We know it's real, we know it's powerful because there's so many things working to separate us from ourselves. And magic can be, is such a it's a connector. When somebody was talking earlier, I was seeing like a plug. So it's a plug into reality and, our natural selves and our true selves.

Zoe: So it's not just a response to something negative, obviously. It's also like our God-given or Goddess given right for me.  

Sherry: Have you all noticed that in your magic, your clients, the people that read your books, things like that, it's almost like, we've been taught for so many generations that we're here to serve, that it's difficult to serve yourself first.[00:49:00]  

Sherry: Have you noticed that? Like if you say, like you were, say, I'm gonna be on this world and I'm gonna do some magic for me and I'm gonna have an orgasm for me, I'm not gonna have an orgasm for you. You get yours, I'm gonna get mine and it's my right. It is my privilege. To enjoy that when I'm eating a sandwich and people come up to you and go, you know, you didn't offer me any.

Sherry: No, I didn't. But if you want some, it's on the table, right? When we're doing things and offering, when I do my work in offering and I bring a plate of food to my ancestor after they've helped me, then that is something that I'm doing in worship. But when I'm doing work for me, where I want that job, I want that whatever I'm asking for, I [00:50:00] want, because in Hoodoo, for me, I don't judge over if I want your stuff or my stuff

Sherry: So if I want, if I want your shit and I'm doing my work to get your shit, and my ancestors agree with that, Then I'm gonna do that without guilt.

Sherry: I find that so many of us have loads of just the guilt and then we just are hunched over and we can't even, you know, I love to watch Zoe do the yoga poses where she's lifting her body up and she's able to do all of these magical things in spirit, because I feel so many of us are so burdened, we can't even stretch.

Sherry: We can't even move our bodies. I see so many of our women [00:51:00] we're hunched. You come over to them and you ask 'em something. Maybe they're helping you in a store or something, and their heads are down. They don't even wanna look you in your eye. Because they're not worthy. You're here to buy something and I'm here as a lowly salesperson.

Sherry: What? Time to rise up y'all.

Amy: Let me take it in for a second. How, do those of us who have not connected with our own personal value in this way. So, you talked about, you know, a ritual shower. Can anyone expand on that notion of how we can bring that feeling? Because I think Yeah, Loli has something, I think that [00:52:00] what's amazing is what we find, especially with fems, especially with women, is that the better we take care of ourselves, the more energy we have for that side project.

Amy: Although me, I'm keeping that forever, this side project of helping other people, it's not my main deal. This is my side project, but yeah. Loli, please, please.  

Loli: I believe, and what has been serving me very well. The practice and the continuous practice of self devotion. And a lot of times capitalism will tell us, oh, individualism is this and that, da da da, da.

Loli: It's like, no, you brought that to us. You taught us dividing, conquer. When they, when they create division, it's to conquer us, right? Dividing, conquer, it's tale as old as time, right? So practicing self devotion. You got an altar for your answers. You got an altar for this goddess, this goddess, this god, this, et cetera.

Loli: You gotta shrine for this. You shrine for that. What about you? Does your home reflect a sanctuary for yourself? [00:53:00] Is your bedroom a space for yourself or is it a hoarding space for more electronic things and other things that just feed off of you? Practicing self devotion. Are you speaking positive words into yourself?

Loli: It goes beyond the inner child healing. It goes beyond the inner teenager healing. Are you practicing self devotion? How do you talk about yourself? Are you using words like, I'm so silly, or I'm so broke, or I'm so this and that, or Oh, I hate being single, or I hate that I'm in this situation. How are you practicing self devotion?

Loli: Cuz your ancestors are watching, your Goddesses are watching, your angels are watching all of that. Okay? So practicing self devotion, I think is the main, thing that will help with that. But also understanding that as you continue to pour into that self devotion practice, you are able to pour as well into community, not in a way that overextends yourself, which is why I've had to take off the labels off myself because Pisces rising, I'm gonna just keep going and going and going and going.

Loli: It's about pouring back into your community at your capacity, respecting [00:54:00] your capacity, and knowing that there's no shame around it. Okay? There's no guilt to carry with that. It just is what it is. And that's okay. And if your people can't get with that, they're not your people, right? The whole point of community is unity.

Loli: Keep the unity in community, okay? Talking specifically about the diaspora and black people and people who have black birthing bodies, okay? This is the group that has the number one, highest rate of premature children being birthed. And there is a reason for that. The body can't even rest to give birth to this next generation.

Loli: The premature levels are so high in the community, it's the highest in the, in all of communities. And that is a reflection of this urgency to give birth to things because capitalism tells us to. And I believe that with more focus on self devotion and more support of community that recognizes the unity in community, that is what's going to bring us forward.

Loli: That is what's going to launch us [00:55:00] into the revolution. And not just to make history, but to become the timeline, to become the ones in charge and and so on and so on and so on. And it's not about power. It's not about consumption because absolute power leads to absolute corruption.

Loli: It's about balance, ease, and flow, right? Elevation. And that comes with starting with a self devotion of yourself then saying, okay, I've pour into my cup, it has runneth over. My feet are anointed in this, in this life energy, which is water. Now I can step outside of this space and pour some of that energy into my community.

Loli: And not community that's looking for you to just feed into them. But community, that's also feeding into you because people will come to your table with just a plate and got nothing else to offer you. And that's not community at all either.  

Thea: I feel like that's all real. Two of cups energy, just like, let's come together and fill each other's cups.

Loli: Yeah,  

Thea: I [00:56:00] was thinking about desire cuz we were talking about orgasms and the right to them. And I feel like that's also a key. And a lot of times when people, if they come to me for reading, I'm always like, okay, so, you know, like, what are we here? What, on the table? And sometimes you'll get five things.

Thea: And I'm like, no, what do you want? And when someone lands on what they want, like what they desire, you feel it. It's an instant energy shift. And I can feel their desire through the screen and I'm like, yes, we're gonna do this. All the other things, it's just clouding your mind. If you could just follow like what you feel and then the reading just like opens up into this whole world.

Thea: And so our right to pleasure, our right to feel good, our right to chase our desires. [00:57:00] And more than that we're saying entitlement. Like the, what is that? It's like a directive. It's like, this is what you're here to do and that's why you want it. And I wonder, you know, if we all felt, we were allowed or if we all felt the call of what we desired and followed that like the arrow that it is, like what would this world look like?

Thea: And it reminds me all the time to continue to follow, follow my desire, which changes. It changes all the time. And that's the other thing, people will wanna put you in a box and say, this is who you are. It's what you do, it's what you like. And always coming back to that, that's a wild spirit. That's, that's nothing that's static, that's nothing for you to, latch onto or identify with.

Thea: It is an, it is an arrow and it could change and it could open up and it can go back and it can [00:58:00] circle around. And when I enter a project through the lens of desire as well, it does a thing where it takes it out of a sort of a, I'll have like a mental outline. Say I'm like writing something. Or sometimes if I feel stuck in like a maze, I'll just go back out and I'll just like write a poem.

Thea: I'll just do, or I'll just like make a bowl of pasta. I don't know. I, you know what I mean? I'm just in it and then I'm like, oh, this is what it means to feel alive. We'll come back to that.  

OlaOmi: I think that the juxtaposition. Of being the descendants of people who were enslaved and then becoming working class members of a capitalist society has us stuck in a loop of thinking that we are a means of production, particularly for black women.

OlaOmi: We are the creators of the capital that made this place. The capital came out of us, the [00:59:00] capital that made this place that we now live in, whether it is here in the United States or the Caribbean, or any of those places that were created by the capital that we gave birth to. So when you think about black women in fems, because that was what we did historically, there is a way that we glorify being a means of production.

OlaOmi: Right? I remember being married. Not to say anything bad about anybody who was married, but I wake up every morning and the first prayer I give is of thanksgiving, I ain't nobody's wife. But anyway, we'll move on. But I remember being married and before I would fall asleep, I would do a checklist of, had I made everybody happy that day, right?

OlaOmi: And as I begin to descend into madness in that marriage, literally I'm a writer, so it's gonna sound real flowery, but that's what the hell was going on. I got a wonderful black woman therapist, all praises to her. I will continue to praise [01:00:00] her name forever in this lifetime in the next, and she asked me one time, are you on the checklist?

OlaOmi: And that was blasphemous to me. What would I be doing on the checklist? She was like, you don't check to see in a day if you've made yourself happy? I was not raised to do that. I was not raised to do that. And I tell you, I was raised by a family of witches. By today's standards, I was raised by a family of bad bitches.

OlaOmi: That's what people call the kinda women that raised me. No joke. That's the kind of women that raised me. They were hell raisers, right? But still, I was not raised to, before I fell asleep, put myself on the checklist of people that I made happy. And when she put that thought in my mind, that was what planted the seed for the path that I find myself on today.

OlaOmi: Because I was like, well damn, not only should I be [01:01:00] on the list, why is anybody else on the list? If I'm goin to sleep, shouldn't I be making sure I made myself happy today? The other people need to check and see if they happy children, husband, lovers of any kind, cats, you know, whatever other kind of pet I've had. They need to check on themselves.

OlaOmi: I need to be checking on myself. But that is always a radical thought for black women in fems, we are used to and very, entrenched in thinking of ourselves as a means of production. And everyone is in a capitalist society, but because of that place that we hold as the creators of capital, there is a particular type of way that it's entrenched.

OlaOmi: And so when you're counseling black women or doing divination for black women or teaching black women about magic, you have to spend so much time stripping down that layer that just gets to the human being. And, [01:02:00] every, I don't teach any class without saying you're not a means of production. Sometime when you do a divination Oshun will say, tell this person that she needs to take at least two baths a day and she needs to sleep for at least 10 hours. And what do I hear every time? I don't have time to do that. You ain't got time to wash your ass? What kinda life is you living where you ain't got time to wash yo' ass. Right? That's a sin, now thats a sin, you see what I'm saying? And you ain't got time to get adequate sleep. What kinda life are you living? Right? But we are entrenched in that. So I think that it's always revolutionary.

OlaOmi: It is always a liberation force to say: I am a human being and what I want matters. Not because it's good for anybody else, but because it's gonna put a smile on my face. It's gonna make me giggle. It's not gonna save the community. [01:03:00] It's not gonna even make my children happy. My lover is not gonna think that it's exceptionally beautiful, but I am going to giggle when I do it.

OlaOmi: I can't believe I did that. That's reasoning enough. . That's reason enough. Nobody is a means of production, but black woman, you in particular, you are not a mule. We really, there's a work in coming up out of that way of seeing ourselves. That is a daily thing. Even for me still now, as a wonderful 53 year old Crone, daily, there is a reminder that I'm not a mule. Right?

OlaOmi: Because somebody who you think you owe service to is gonna come and ask you to do something. I got six kids, so every day somebody's asking me to do somtin. Right? And certainly I owe service to people. I don't, right? Every day somebody's gonna come and ask you to do something. So every day it's a conversation of, are you a human being or are you a mute?[01:04:00]  

OlaOmi: What thing are you, right? So, yes, I definitely feel what you just said, Thea.  

Zoe: There's something for me about. The cost. Cuz there's a cost to the type of liberation that we're walking towards that we're yearning for that. Right? And so the cost of not doing it, I think we have to see that the cost of not doing it is bigger than the cost of doing it. Because there's so few of us actually doing it.

Zoe: Like, let's be real, like throughout history, that's why we know people's names cuz there's so few. So it's like, I'm a daughter, my mother doesn't go for all this stuff. You know what, the only reason she doesn't come busting in this door is cuz she's sleeping right now. Right? So there's always like some sort of, some expectation and [01:05:00] there is a cost to say, not you, me.

Zoe: And I think that for some of us it's just too high. Maybe next lifetime. Right? Isn't that what Erica said? Right next? Maybe I'll be free in my next lifetime. But in this lifetime, I'm just gonna like go along. I'm just gonna go along to get along. Right? And so it's like, yeah, I think that there's a very real cost to this walk that, we don't always see on TikTok and like the social medias when people are like, you know, like in the flowers and I'm on there too, so it's like fine.

Zoe: But I'm just saying there's a cost to true liberation for black women. Fems in particular.  

Zoe: This is an outside . This is an outside existence for most of us, I will say.  

Zoe: [01:06:00] Right?

Amy: And, I just wanna add, Loli you were saying before, if the people around you aren't giving you that energy, aren't lifting you up, then they're not for you. And, you know, but that's the kind of cost that you're talking about, Zoe is like it's really fucking heartbreaking when you realize that the people that you thought were there for you aren't there for you.

Amy: And, but again, like knowing your self worth, being your authentic self, this, is the cost we're talking about, it hurts. It hurts really bad, but in my experience, it's been worth it. It still hurts. It hurts every day, but it's still, it's still worth it for me. And that's okay. But it does hurt.

Amy: And I wanna thank you for reminding us that it's not free. You know, liberation is not free and it's not even cheap. And I think it was Faith Ringold who said [01:07:00] that, it never ends. It's a constant struggle. Right? And she wrote a lot about that and painted about it too.  

Amy: And I wanna ask the astrologers, if you find that, you know, Pluto taking 800 years or whatever it is to do its course, does that make you sort of, release that urgency of capitalism because you know that we're on a different timeline than maybe Western thought would have us believe.

Thea: I mean, there's so much to say there because it's Pluto, right? So it's, it's already an invitation to relinquish, surrender and like shed some skin. There's a real serpentine quality to being able to let go of past selves, past versions. And I feel like I've been saying this for one, like we are at such precipice energy.

Thea: So, Pluto is about [01:08:00] to, for the first time in 15 years, switch signs from Capricorn and Earth sign to Aquarius and Air sign. And it hasn't been in Aquarius since like the 17 hundreds. And so it is a big deal. We'll get like a three month sneak peek and then it'll back up. And I've been thinking a lot about this, cuz sometimes I'm like, oh, that feels a little scary. Right?

Thea: Feels a little scary how it's gonna hit my Aquarius moon? But you know, I'm okay. Like I'm okay to be scared. And I also think, I also think that there's... People are scared because the structures that where erected during, you know, Pluto and Capricorn, or just like during, if we go even back further during the course of building and erecting empires during colonialism. [01:09:00] We know that these structures cannot hold, that they're crumbling.

Thea: And it just really feels like that the call is to like, where is our power? And it is with this sort of, being at the precipice of change, being willing to see, and the ways that people are going to share resources, share power, but also that there's gonna be a total shift also because we're in the Aquarius, like the grand conjunctions between Saturn and Jupiter, which set the collective tone or happening in Air Science.

Thea: So, we've left the era of Earth and we are entering the era of Air. This is how we can all gather from our separate physical locations and gather in spirit. And if you think about that exchange, it's a complete dispersion. Right? There's a sort of, we can use our power, [01:10:00] of the collective. We can form groups and organizations.

Thea: We don't need capitals, we don't need erected buildings, we don't need traditional power structures. We don't need figureheads. We are our own figureheads. We can. I think that there's gonna be fear, but there's gonna also be people who, as we were saying in the beginning, who are born at this exact moment for that call.

Thea: And we can do it together and we can hold each other up, when the moments get really scary because that's where our power is.  

Loli: I just want to add to that. When I thing about Pluto, Aquarius, of course we have to look back in history and as Thea was saying, the last time Pluto was in Aquarius was in the 17 hundreds.

Loli: This is also literally the time of the Haitian Revolution. One of the greatest acts of freedom that was not given. It was taken. So when I [01:11:00] think about the cost of liberation, as witches, we understand there's a balance in everything. We understand that there are sacrifices to be had. And so, Pluto in Aquarius is really gonna ask us, are you ready to provide the offering?

Loli: Are you ready to give up the offering? Are you ready to give and put this sacrifice on the altar and say, take it. Pluto, power and control. Yes, but Aquarius is the 11th house. It's the in between. Right? The 10th house to me is the material realm. The 12th house is the spiritual realm. So we're in this, we're going into this in-between space where people are becoming more aware of themselves.

Loli: Aquarians are known to be revolutionaries and innovators because they understand that balance of the in-between there, into the balance of both the material realm and the spiritual realm. And knowing that you don't have to give up one over the other. There just has to be balance. But it does come with sacrifice and the Haitian Revolution.

Loli: Even [01:12:00] looking at my ancestors of Jamaica, they had the most revolutions, in terms of uprisings, in history, in slavery. Okay? In Jamaica. And they also are the island, the only country that has the most churches per kilometer in the world. That speaks volumes to me and, I think that everyone is ready for that change.

Loli: I believe that the scam-demic, yes, I'm calling it a scam-demic. I don't care who wants to cancel if you're saying that. The scam-demic was a reminder of what you can do on your own. It was a dark time for a lot of people and there was a lot of transitions of souls and et cetera, but it was a reminder of what we can do on your own.

Loli: The Queen, transition, okay. When that happened, it was like a confirmation of everything that we already knew was coming. Because before that happened, there were certain islands in the Caribbean that said, we are separating ourselves from the monarchy. Barbados and Jamaica being a couple of them. Fast forward eight months later, less than a year later, and the Queen is gone.

Loli: These are [01:13:00] signs of Pluto entering Aquarius. These are signs of the birth, the rebirth, maybe even of the revolution, which we say is not to be televised. Well, we'll see about that, but it comes from sacrifice. And Capricorn who is a Cardinal sign, is still Earth and can be also very egoistic and very much, I want the stability, I want the safety net.

Loli: I don't wanna give this up cause I work so hard for it. Let that go. Right? There's a bigger picture. That is being conjured and brewed at the time, at the moment. And Saturn entering Pisces, you know, on, on the 7th of March is just the cherry on top of all that, right? So if you don't know, you'll find out real soon because Saturn and Pisces going to ensure that.

Loli: Okay, and I'm talking to all the Pisces placements, all the Gemini placements, Sagatarius placements, Virgo placements, I'm talking to you. So [01:14:00] yeah, it's time. And honestly, there's a lot of fear that is around Pluto, Aquarius because it does bring on the change of technology and the rise of the robots and all these other things in-between.

Loli: But no one should be afraid. You know, do not fear the change. And if there is fear, fear is just a lack of knowledge, right? And knowledge is power. But wisdom is the magic that is knowledge applied. So educate yourself, prepare yourself accordingly. Ask yourself, what does that mean? What does that look like?

Loli: What does Spirit tell you? It looks like. What does your community tell you it looks like? What is your community projecting and telling you what it looks like? And are you okay with that? And if not, how can you change it? This is the time to do that.

Amy: Yes. I feel like you have all brought this same energy, but Thea, gave us the name, this precipice energy, something is about to happen, and I'm so [01:15:00] grateful to have been in the room to witness the formulation of this precipice energy. Maybe what Zoe, would call the, the beginning of the fool's journey out into the unknown, but equipped, equipped.

Amy: Our time went so fast. But I want to give you all an opportunity to tell us how our listeners can shower you with abundance, because, Asha Frost is an indigenous writer, and she recently wrote: "People ask me all the time, how can they support indigenous people"? And she said, "I say, we're all around you. We write books. We make art. We own stores".

Amy: So if any of you are wondering, you know, how can I celebrate Black History Month? Well, there are amazing Black Witches all around you who do charts, [01:16:00] who write books, who teach classes. You don't need to ask, you just need to look. So I'm gonna start with Zoe and ask how, if our listeners wanna get in touch with you and shower you with abundance, how might they do that?

Zoe: Oh, there's so many ways to shower me with Abundance . Okay, so I have two books. One is called From Ashes to Angels Dust, A Journey Through Womanhood, and that is a collection of interviews I did with survivors of domestic and sexual violence, chronicling their stories. And there's also poetry in there.

Zoe: And then my second book is In Praise of the Witch. So you can get either one of those books, you can get 'em at, you can ask them if you don't wanna go to the, you know, those other stores, you can go to your independent stores and they will order them for you. This week I'm actually starting a Tarot 101 class.

Zoe: It is a six week course. We will have started by the time this airs, but there will be another one after this one. You can go to my [01:17:00] website, I am zoeflowers.com and I do lots of different readings, tarot and all that good stuff. And I am going to be making magical candles very soon. Magically infused candles.

Zoe: So when those come out, y'all can buy them .  

Amy: I had a preview when I visited your place and they are so self evidently magical. As soon as you look at them, you're like, this has power Sherry Shone call forth the shower of abundance from our listeners.  

Sherry: I am so happy to ta share with y'all. Okay, so if you want to shower me with abundance, you can go to, thathoodoolady.com.

Sherry: That's where you can buy book two, Hoodoo for Everyone. You can also ask for the Hoodoo Guide to the Bible. I call that the red one. It's the white and red book. It's my very first book that was, that was birthed on Samhain [01:18:00] 2019. We have an additional thing. I agree with Zoe that working with your local black-owned BIPOC, Indigenous owned commun, I mean all of it, you know, if you were in the Oregon area, the Washington State area, the Northwest area, and you're not buying your books from Third Eye Bookstore.

Sherry: I'm just saying. Okay. There's so many other things out there. Okay. So there's that. I am working with Three Sisters from Vegas here in Oregon and myself, and we are putting together y'all a Hoodoo Wine and Sip event, and I'm walking in my abundance. That this will be the first one will be in May, and the rest we will continue to go from state [01:19:00] to state to state to bless everyone in this Hoodoo and Wine and Sip.

Sherry: If y'all got to see this beautiful image that we're going to create, it's Hoodoo based, but it's also Goddess energy, but it's also Witchy, but it's also everything just in the painting that you're going to be drawing. It is abundance in it. It's it's elements that you need for Hoodoo. It's elements that you need to continue to walk in your own worth and walk in your own acceptance of conjure.

Sherry: So many of us in conjure have been told, I'm not black enough to practice. I'm not, whatever enough. It's always that enough. Have y'all noticed that when anyone wanna tries to bring you down, they say you aren't enough. Like they have a a wand that you have to fight for. Anyway, so that's how you can, that's how you can work with me.

Amy: And we'll [01:20:00] put all of this on, the website, of course, where the show notes for this episode. Loli Moon, Loli Moon, the shower of Abundance will rain upon you.  

Loli: Yes, if anything was ignited in you as I was speaking, you can definitely check with me via Instagram at Mystic Moon Medicine. No funny spelling because there are a lot of, there's scammers and people out there trying to, I'm sure, imitate all of us, you know.

Loli: So at Mystic Moon Medicine on Instagram, mysticmoonmedicine.com as well, also Patreon where there is Astrology 101 and a bunch of other things between that. I pour into there and I have a podcast, what's the Brew with Lily Moon, where I go on my tantrums of lighting fires and all sorts of things, . And, yeah, I think that's it.

Amy: Amazing. Listeners, please, please for your own good. [01:21:00] Really it's for your own good. Thea!  

Thea: Hi. Okay, my child's crying, so I'm gonna make it quick.  

Thea: My website is theanichelle.com N like Nancy, like Nichelle Nichols. And my Instagram is theaastrology, t h e a astrology. You can, if you want a reading with me, I would love it.

Thea: I also, I really focus on natal readings, electional, astro, magic, timing, all of those things. So if you wanna get married, if you wanna like, launch a business, speaking of abundance, like ask me and I'll pick the date. Okay, so I also, have a short story coming out as a part of the, Infinite [01:22:00] Constellations Anthology, which is actually not astrologically related, but it is a, speculative future anthology with writers from the Global Majority.

Thea: It is, I'm so excited for this group of writers. It comes out March 7th this year, , and it's the, the other contributors are just blown my mind so far. So you can pre-order it now, but support your local bookshop and get that, In addition. Something else I was gonna say. Oh, I am the director of production at the Channey app, which is the app by Channey Nicholas supports healing and mindfulness and y'all, we have the best our, it is a company that lives its values, if you wanna talk about radical abundance.

Thea: And we have like beautiful physical products now as well. So it's really exciting. And so that would be like a way also to support. But yeah, also just give me vibes. I take 'em ,  

Amy: So many vibes and so very, [01:23:00] very, very much more OlaOmi. Can you give us your abundance shower and then if you would be gracious enough to take us out with a short reading so that we can just bask in that as we, as we exit the circle.

Amy: Thank you so much, OlaOmi.  

OlaOmi: Definitely will, my abundant shower, I am Got 2 be Oshun on all platforms, G O T, the number 2, the letter B O S H U N. I teach Witchy Wednesday courses ever since the overturn of Roe versus Wade that's what Oshun has called me to, called me to do. So I do those every Wednesday of various and sundry on various and sundry topics for February.

OlaOmi: We'll be doing HooDoo as a Spiritual Liberation Technology. So please check those out. What other ways can you shower me? I'm also Got2beOshun on Cash app. And I take, good vibes as well. I do have books on [01:24:00] Amazon, Ona Agbani, Raising Revolutionaries, which is my, black homeschooling and unschooling book. Ona Agbani, which is my first book on the Tradition of the Anago people.

OlaOmi: And then S'Otitio ~ Be Truth, which is my second book on the tradition of the Anago people. So what we're gonna read from tonight is Ona Agbani, and we're gonna talk about Eniyan. So Eniyan is one of the Anago or Yoruba words for people, and it means one who is chosen. That's what being a human being means, is one who is chosen.

OlaOmi: "Once an Eniyan is givin birth to on the physical plane. It is her duty to revere those spiritual and physical forces that provided the body in which to live and a family line in which to be born. This is accomplished through the reverence of one's family and one's family Egun which is your ancestors.

OlaOmi: Worship of your [01:25:00] ancestors keeps you in contact with the goals of your family lineage as well as your own. And the term Egun means bones and it generally is used to denote the spiritual force of one's bloodline ancestors and the force that is held within your body".

OlaOmi: So I wanted to read that passage to remind you of the miracle of your birth, and that it is a self projected miracle. You are one chosen to be here. Your ancestors refer to all of us as Egun. You chose the time, the space, the lineage in which to be born, and so it is a self-created miracle. So as we talk about our power tonight, I wanted to read this to remind you that your first powerful [01:26:00] masterpiece is what you looking at in the mirror.

OlaOmi: That's your first powerful masterpiece. You went into the womb of your mother and you decided that those cells would begin to divide and look at you. There you are. Perfect, perfect and fulfilling the destiny.

Amy: Thank you all so much for creating future histories of black magic and for helping me celebrate all of you and each other and community and precipice energy. Thank you so much all of you for being on the precipice with me tonight, for being in circle for sharing your ideas with our listeners.

Amy: A deep breath and just so much gratitude, Zoe, Sherry OlaOmi, Thea, Loli. Amazing, amazing, [01:27:00] amazing, amazing. I'm so grateful. I'm so grateful. And listeners, all of this, not all of the information, all of the links and contact information will be on our website. Please, you know, take this opportunity to support your local Black Witch.

Amy: We love you so much, and blessed fucking be. Thank you all so much.  

Sherry: Thank you.  

OlaOmi: Thank you.  

Thea: Thank you, Amy,  

OlaOmi: Thank you so much.  

Zoe: Blessed Be  

Outro: Be a Witch. Be a witch. Be a witch. Witch. You must be a witch.  

Amy: The Missing Witches Project is created and produced by Risa Dickens and Amy Torok. If you wanna support Missing Witches, check out the all new website at missingwitches.com.

Subscribe to Missing Witches Rx.

Inbox magic, no spam. A free, weekly(ish) prescription of spells and other good shit to light you up and get you through. Unsubscribe any time.

Oops! There was an error sending the email, please try again.

Awesome! Now check your inbox and click the link to confirm your subscription.